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Talk:Leon Trotsky
I wonder if Stalin will be too busy in TWTPE to have Trostky done in? TR 00:16, September 26, 2010 (UTC) :Does it really take that much out of a guy? Turtle Fan 01:11, September 26, 2010 (UTC) ::Donut-Now that the big switch has taken place, I think Trostky has gotten a new lease on life. Maybe HT will do "something" with that? Not sure what. The obvious choice of "run the USSR" isn't really plausible unless Stalin dies but the USSR beats the Second Coalition anyway. ::Or he might just casually mention in TWTPE IV that "despite the big switch, Stalin hadn't been too busy to have Trotsky done in with a chainsaw." (Because it's AH, so he shouldn't be killed with an icepick.) TR 17:22, October 14, 2011 (UTC) :::I'm trying to think of some way that the big switch might make some government somewhere more willing to take him in and protect him. Mexico accepted him as an exile, but they generally didn't seem to care all that much whether the NKVD got to him or not. Could either Mexico (which has yet to appear in TWTPE, I believe) or someone else be more committed to keeping him alive as a way of flipping Stalin off? ::::In reviewing the history, Lazaro Cardenas (president December 1934-November 30, 1940) was pretty hip to Trotsky and the Spanish Republic, even going to so far as to give safe passage to fleeing republicans. However, Cardenas was out of office by November, 1940, and his successor, Manuel Camacho, appears to have been less enthusiastic about supporting leftist causes. ::::As you pointed out Mexico has had no role as of yet, and with the way things have gone, I'd be surprised if it did much of anything unless provoked. So, even if Camacho is president, Trotsky may still be "useful" in Mexico. TR 20:26, October 14, 2011 (UTC) :::::I was about to say "HT's writing a lot of Mexican stories these days," but then I realized he's not, not really. It's just that LatA naturally gave us cause to write a bunch of Mexican articles. And really not all that many there, either; just enough to let us visit a few new subcats like Governors of Mexican States. Turtle Fan 00:26, October 15, 2011 (UTC) :::I doubt it. Everyone in the New and Improved Axis (or Second Coalition, for those of a more antiquarian bent) hates communists in general, as does the US, while the communist groups in Spain and eastern Europe and even America are thoroughly Stalinist as witnessed by Weinberg's entrapment of La Martellita. :::The Chinese communists are thoroughly run by Mao according to well, a couple throwaway lines here and there. 100% of the available evidence, anyway. Mao was very concerned about keeping the CCP outside the sphere of influence of the CCCP even before the POD; he had seen what happened in Mongolia and was determined that China not suffer the same fate. Plus of course he was a megalomaniac and insisted on being the only big fish in the pond. That could preclude the possibility of Trotsky finding refuge with him if he could somehow make it to China. On the other hand, maybe Mao would entertain delusions of grandeur that involved Trotsky taking over the Kremlin with Chinese aid, and the Soviets dancing to a Chinese tune as a result. It would never happen, of course, but Mao hatched some wackier schemes still in his time. ::::That could be interesting, actually. TR 20:26, October 14, 2011 (UTC) :::::It would. Problem is, we just lost our only Chinese POV--a POV in China, that is. There's an open slot since Yasroslavsky bought it, maybe it will go to Max Weinstein? He gives us the fall of the Western garrisons in Shanghai, the Japs capture him alive and are transporting him to Unit 731. Along the way CCP guerrillas attack the column and liberate him. Being a communist himself, he finds acceptance among them and joins with them. Nothing HT hasn't done before, certainly. Turtle Fan 00:26, October 15, 2011 (UTC) :::Interestingly, the Japanese might be willing to look the other way of Mao wanted to involve Trotsky in some anti-Stalinist plot. Trotsky would probably be no more dangerous in charge of the USSR, and if he made a play at the job it would cause domestic political strife that could only benefit the Soviets' enemies. :::So maybe the Second Coalition would be willing to safeguard his person after all. The last generation of German leaders had even less reason to love Communists than the current one does, but they helped Lenin get home just the same. In the middle of a war against the USSR the Nazi official gospel might be that that was woefully shortsighted, but it did accomplish the goal of giving the CP victory over Russia and a secure eastern flank, so they might try to duplicate that short-term success just the same. ::::That could also be interesting, although you'd have the stumbling blocks of: Trotsky's a dead man the minute he sets foot in Soviet territory, so the SC would have to make sure he received all manner of protection, and you'd possibly be trading in the guy who wanted revolution in one country for the one who wanted it all over the world. Then Trotsky would have to decide that becoming the recationary Stalin always claimed he was would be worth becoming the leader of a breathing-room reduced Russia. Oh, yeah, and he's a Jew. That'll go over great with the Nazi party true believers. TR 20:26, October 14, 2011 (UTC) :::::Huh, forgot he's a Jew. Yeah, they'd hate him; but if you believe that a given group of people's historical destiny is as destroyers of culture, and you need a particular culture destroyed, why not turn them loose? If the Second Coalition does make a deal with Trotsky, I think they'd be less concerned with what kind of revolutionary he'd be than whether his presence will provoke a struggle with Stalin that will end up destroying both. That's the real payoff for them, not the possibility that they could get a Soviet stooge. If that's what they want, they'd be better off raising up local quislings like Kaminski and Voskoboinik, or Astrouski in Belarus. Turtle Fan 00:26, October 15, 2011 (UTC) :::I find all of this pretty low-probability, but within the realm of the conceivable. And since this is the second time this week that we're guessing about what circumstances could prompt HT to write Person X into TWTPE, and we're nine full months away from Volume IV, it's looking like we're going to be exploring that realm pretty thoroughly. Turtle Fan 19:27, October 14, 2011 (UTC) ::::True, and in the grand scheme of things, I'm probably getting way too excited about the possibility that Trotsky might become a relevant figure, letting my inner Gizzi out. 20:26, October 14, 2011 (UTC) :::::Well this is currently HT's largest project, it's holding our attention much more closely than we'd expected, we've got nine months till the next book comes out, and at present we haven't even got a title to guide our predicttions. I see nothing wrong with indulging in an extrapolative free-for-all to see us through the winter. Turtle Fan 00:26, October 15, 2011 (UTC)